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| Subject: | | Evolution |
| From: | |
Z.Z.
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posted
Thu, Jul 26 2007, 11:17pm
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Interesting blog Wisker, a good layman explaination of how evolution happens.
Anyone could understand that.
Well, most people would understand it.....
;D |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
wisker
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posted
Fri, Jul 27 2007, 2:20am
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thanks ZZ i had heard a few people talking about evolution and i didnt think they enderstood it i laid it down for them plain and simple. many creationists put down evolution but they have never even learned it. so this way they may know what they are talking about |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
FLUFFY
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posted
Tue, Jul 31 2007, 6:21pm
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Ok evolution: this is what i understood from it. correct me if im wrong.
Big bang... (not relavent to the process but where did everything come from yadda yadda yadda)
comets brought most of the liquid water (ice)
the process of evaporation and condensation (ive read about an experiment where water had been evaporated "zapped" by electricity and condensed then evaporated again, after some time, months if i recall on the bottom of the "condenser tube" an orange slime appeared which actually was amino acids (building blocks of DNA and RNA)
yadda yadda yadda simple bacteria
yadda yadda yadda predatory bacteria evolved to feed on the others
the race between predator and prey got bacteria to change to become faster smarter bigger more versatile
green alga->moss yadda yadda yadda
very soon jelly fish and simple brainless organisms appeared yadda yadda yadda
mollusks->crustations->fish->reptiles->birds
Insects evolved from crustations only they "came out" alot sooner then fish/reptiles.
But the thing that amazes me most is that WE human beings consider our selfs to be the top of the pyramid, the cream of the crop, the perfection of evolution.
Thats bull (pardon my french) we have no natural defenses we arnt fast nor strong nor agile, our sense of smell is poor at best out eye sight is good but not the best so how did WE manage to survive up to this day? this question has bugged me for years.
No other animal cares for their young for such a long period, no other animals birth process is as painful as a humans.
So how the hell did we manage to assume such a place in the natural order of things?
Im trying to find the answers in alternative literature/studies like the Devolution theory which claims that WE are all DEVOLVING.
If u got anything else to add please do :)
Pardon my grammar English as a 4th language is kinda taking its toll on my mental health. |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
Z.Z.
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posted
Tue, Jul 31 2007, 10:48pm
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"Insects evolved from crustations"
So THATS why crustaceans look like bugs to me!
LOL! |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
wisker
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posted
Wed, Aug 1 2007, 5:15am
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well fluffy im going to try to answer your question.
short and simple
its our intellegence that keeps us at the top of the pyramid. our ability to make and use tools efficiently helps as well. like apes can use tools to do certain tasks.our social capibilities help us to build cities and use money to support or economic system. ants bees and termites also use social groups to remain alive, but unlike us they cant live with out their social group.
we have not always been at the top though. simple organisms such as bacteria have plauged us for years with disease.most of which we have over come using our inteligence through antibiotics and general medication. i feel that we will eventually over come all forms of bacterial infection one day.
our ability to make tools has helped us hunt and preform agriculture. like some ants farm fungus to survive.(i think they are leaf cutter ants)some termites as well from what i have read.we were able to construct traps to catch prey either ambush or mechanical traps. spiders also use traps called webs as im certain you already know.
most of the technology that we have, can be looked at as being copied from nature. we just have the inteligence to copy it in a diferent way through problem solving. even electronics in some ways mimic our central nervous system. i have even heard it said that when henry ford was developing cars he used the human body as an outline for the vehicles. now i dont know the truth to that but thats what ive heard.
so no we are not the top of the pyramid we still have not even conquered the most simple of life bacteria.but we are a notible inhabitant of our planet and we most likly will reach the top of the pyrimid if we dont destroy our selves first
one reason we cant defeat bacteria is they are so much smaller that they evolve more quickly, and adapt to our medications and antibiotics. so we have to find new ways to fight them. it may be a loosing battle on our part. |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
uselessinfo
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posted
Wed, Sep 5 2007, 10:58am
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The bacteria should be fought by the realization that we shouldnt manufacture & mase produce things that sustain there lives.
as simple as old bread makes mold, which in turn causes a infection that needs to be treated by piniccilan[the same mold]. treat a snake bite with snake venom. the snake is the source not the venom |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
spitfirebird
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posted
Sun, Aug 12 2007, 5:36pm
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Actually, humans are not 'at the top of a pyramid', there is no pyramid, not even a vertical line, evolution is not always going up, there is nothing at the top, it all branches outwards, and every living species is touching the edge of ever expanding circle. To Tartarus with humans, the Amoebas are at the top! |
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| Subject: | | Corrected blog |
| From: | |
Z.Z.
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posted
Tue, Aug 21 2007, 11:47pm
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Hi Wisker :)
Your dads proof is pretty good.
There are a few more corrections that I found:
"We live in a world that is constantly changing, just like our clothing. Seas vanish and deserts appear, mountains grow and plants and animals adapt to survive. Just like we adapt to our environment, so do the other occupants of our planet. Life forms evolve through mutations and exchange of genetic material.
Mankind has adapted to survive in this world in polar, temperate or tropic conditions. Many ideas have evolved as to the evolution of life forms, some make sense and some do not, but nonetheless these are beliefs that have given hope to many and a thought of knowledge to some. Of these beliefs there are two main ones, Evolution and Creationism.
Many creationists say that if man evolved from apes, why are there still apes?
The answer to this question is quite easy. If apes evolved into mankind, or earlier forms of man, it was because of mutations and exchange of genetic material that caused them to adapt to survive. While this happened, not all of the apes mutated, only a select few of their population mutated, leaving some that were the way they were originally. This allowed a new species, which could have been early man, to adapt to survive.
The same applies to dinosaurs evolving into birds. Not all the dinosaurs would have evolved into birds, some would have remained the same, which leads to why these may have become extinct, maybe their unchanged forms could not adapt to the changes in the environment. It also means there could possibly be a few remnants of them left alive today, but this is highly unlikely.
The same could be for Bigfoot. Perhaps it is a mutated or evolved form of man or ape that is struggling to adapt to a changing world, leaving its numbers few, and causing it not to be spotted very often."
1. Removed paragraph break between "we" and "adapt" to continue complete sentence.
2. Added comma after the word "environment" in first paragraph to separate parts of compound sentence.
3. Added comma after the word "forms" in second paragraph to separate parts of compound sentence.
3 1/2. Added comma after the word "ones", removed comma after the word "Evolution".
4. Changed the word "it" in third paragraph to "if" to clarify statement.
5. Changed period after the word "apes" to a comma to continue sentence.
6. Decapitalized the word "why" to continue compound sentence.
7. Removed "to answer" as being redundant in same sentence.
8. Added commas after the words "mankind" and "man" to separate ideas within the compound sentence.
9. Added comma after the word "mutated", and added the word "mutated" to make the sentence understandable.
10. Changed "Causing" to "This allowed", and added a comma after the word "man" to make sentence more understandable.
11. Added comma after the words "birds", "same", and "extinct" to separate ideas within the compound sentence.
12. Removed extraneous period after the word "unlikely" to end sentence.
13. Added comma after the word "world".
14. Changed period after the word "few" to a comma, added the word "and", and decapitalized the word "causing" to complete the sentence. |
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| Subject: | | Re: Corrected blog |
| From: | |
wisker
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posted
Wed, Aug 22 2007, 8:08am
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thanks i added your corrected version to the blog |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
uselessinfo
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posted
Wed, Sep 5 2007, 10:49am
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This seems to be copied out of a 5th grade text book which we all have read and some bought and some did not, which is why we have a site such as this.This theroey of mutations being the sorce of change seems a very desperite means of trying to salvage this evolution theroey trend.
If you study any mutations you will see none are benifitial to the spieces & all kill the creature with out human interferance.
If you find it hard to beleive that we came from something better than us, just look at what your saying, WE came from nothing,that turned into a rock that grew into grampa? |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
Supercryptid
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posted
Thu, Sep 20 2007, 10:53pm
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I'm a Christian, but I have something to say in regards to this post.
Your claim that there are no beneficial mutations is incorrect. First, let me explain that the common definition for beneficial and the mutational definition for beneficial can differ. In terms of natural selection, a beneficial mutation is a mutation that increases an organism's chances of surviving to maturity and reproducing or increases the chances for that organism's offspring reaching maturity and reproducing. A harmful mutation reduces its own prevelance in a population over time, whereas a beneficial mutation increases its own prevelance in a population over time (unless some event kills the individual or group that carries that founding mutation before it can spread).
An example of a mutation that can be beneficial in the right circumstances is the sickle-cell mutation. In people that carry two copies of the sickle-cell allele, it typically is harmful. However, an individual that carries only one copy of the allele has none of the negative symptoms of the disease, but they also have a resistance to malaria. This is called "heterozygote advantage". In regions where malaria is prevelant, having 1 copy of this mutated sickle-cell allele will be beneficial because it will give you an advantage over those people that don't resist malaria. Hence, the sickle-cell mutation is preserved and spreads in these areas. |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
wisker
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posted
Sat, Oct 6 2007, 3:38am
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Im sorry I cant seem to find where i stated that there are no beneficial mutations. If I had you did a very good job of proving your point it was so good that i used it to help a fellow member understand how a mutation can be good. so thank you |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
wisker
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posted
Sat, Oct 6 2007, 3:40am
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i now see that you were talking to the guy i used your post as a reference to sorry about the confusion |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
wisker
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posted
Sat, Oct 6 2007, 3:33am
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I never stated that i believed in this theory of evolution. You are correct that it resembles somthing out of a 5th grade text book. I wrote it very simply so that anyone even the younger members who frequent this site can read and understand as well as the adults.If you read the following post in which one mentions sickle cell anemia and its corelation to malaria you will find that some mutations do benifit the species.
in response to your last statement: Is it possible that an omnipitent being created life so that it could evolve not stating i believe this, but could that be possible. |
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| Subject: | | Re: Evolution |
| From: | |
labete
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posted
Thu, Dec 27 2007, 6:09am
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Four interesting things about evolution.
1. It is not observable or repeatable in a lab or in the natural world - our lives are too short (sadly) to truely examine it!
2. It flies in the face of the second law of thermo-dynamics which states that all things are going from a state of organization to chaos.
3. There are far too many gaps in the fossil record that need filling for the theroy to truely be the ultimate answer (hopefully someday these will be filled, but since Darwins time (150yrs) our technology has not been able to help us as Darwin thought it would).
4. The irriducible complexity of single celled organisims have yet to be disproven. i.e. we cannot present a theory or experiment that will account for the basic building block of life being formed from a "primordial ooze" let lone the DNA that is needed as the blueprint to start life. A cingle cell can contain enough data to fill a small library if it was all printed on 15# paper with a size 10 font.
Evolution is an answer to a humanistic world view where we look for answers in "natural (what we can observe)" ways. We must have faith that all things happen naturally and that there are no other possibilities. "Intelligent designers" do the same thing by using a supernatural means to spark life rather than a natural one. I am a numerical taxonomist, trained in evolutionary biology at a major university in oklahoma. I just wanted to put forth my thoughts as I am struggling with a theory that I have cherished for years. I always look at what is missing before I look at what I already have... |
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