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Subject: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: BRIDGET posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 11:15am 
has anyone seen the chubacabra autopsy on paranormal tv? i saw it last night and found it fascinating. a rancher in texas has a corpse of a supposed chupacabra.. it looks like a new species... and quite a few people have killed them and they all look identical. couldnt find the video online or i would have posted it but i did find this other article http://www.chupacabra60interview.com/ curious to see what you think. some say it is a coyote with mange.. i have seen coyotes and this aint no coyote
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: Stu posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 11:24am 
Why does it "look like a new species"?

What differentiates a mangy coyote from a "new species"?

Just how many "new species" do you see announced through the medium of autopsy on a TV channel dedicated to the proof-free world of the "paranormal"?

If it's a "new species", why does a farmer & not a zoologist have the corpse?

Where have you seen a coyote, & how would you know it was a coyote with mange unless you've seen a coyote with mange?

Etc................zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

A new species.........
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: BRIDGET posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 12:06pm 
I am not sure if you saw the video i saw... definately different characteristics the specimens all have blue eyes.. nursing teets on the side and 2 instead of 4.. extra skin on ear flaps.. extra boney material near tail for possible sitting up right.. no signs of mange on the skin.. more of the look of a hairless dog but rough in nature like an elephant . the lady that has it is a rancher and hunter who seems to have alot of experience dealing in wildlife and the local animals. she is spending all her own money to get dna testing and research. please give it some thought and and think maybe before you just say it cant be a new species.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: Ella posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 6:41pm 
If that's a new species, then Darwin was indeed 100% wrong, because there's no way this could be an example of the survival of the fittest!
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: disco.lemonade posted Tue, Sep 1 2009, 4:14pm 
Elephant like skin can be caused by mange and other types of skin disorders such as staph infections and severe allergies (airborn, contact & food related).

I have fostered dogs for different rescues and had several come to me with "elephant" like skin and NOT had mange.. so this is very possible that it was a wild dog or coyote and had some sort of skin condition or health problem that contributed to hair loss. On this note, there are 2 types of (common) mange disorders: Demodectic (or "red" mange) and Sarcoptic mange .. Sarcoptic mange is very difficult to diagnose, even by a veterinarian with skin scrapings and it usually has characteristics of "elephant" looking skin; thick, grey, bumpy..etc.

Living in Texas myself, I would say a (naturally or diseased) hairless mammal would not stand a good chance of survival due to the harsh conditions (excessive heat, dry climate, fireants, etc).

There is my 2 cents.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: Rainbow Medicine Man posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 3:10pm 
Poor, poor critter...
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY: To Clemente.
From: Ella posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 6:37pm 
From one dog lover to another (and coyotes are canids too): Why in the name of Jesus Christ of Texas aren't these poor creatures humanely euthanized? Shooting them dead would be better than such an unspeakable existence with end-stage sarcoptic mange.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY: To Clemente.
From: EastTxSwamp posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 7:59pm 
I can almost guarantee it, for every mangy coyote that makes the news, ten or twenty more are being shot out in somebody's pasture. And, coyotes are thicker'n ticks out here, and I've never seen one manged out. And I'm one of the biggest animal lovers you'll ever run across- I was a docent at the Ft. Worth Zoo for five years, and I actually went to biologist's school because I'm so down with the animals. Trust me, it's not a widespread problem down here. We can sleep at night without that bothering us.

Swamp
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY: To Clemente.
From: Ella posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 10:28pm 
Glad to hear it.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY To Stu: Thank you,
From: Ella posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 6:35pm 
:-)
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: EastTxSwamp posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 7:48pm 
Oh, come on, Stu, I don't go to sleep when Nessie or some Limey "wolf" shows up in a post. Give me the chupacabras, it's part of the culture here in the Lone Star State. Don't Mess With Texas!

Swamp
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: Rangoon posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 12:37pm 
has anyone seen the chubacabra autopsy on paranormal tv?

No offense but if it is a real "new" species I think we will watch for it on regular network TV or places such as discovery,National Geo etc. I did see the video from the police cruiser which was interesting.

DNA from the body is the only important part really.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY--Goon:
From: Ella posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 6:49pm 
Right you are. If DNA from that poor, diseased carcass does prove this to be a new species, I will publicly retract my opinion and apologize to Bridget and to everyone who shares her opinion. I have seen these pitiful creatures on the Internet before, and the consensus of zoologists commenting is that they are coyotes with end-stage Demodex or sarcoptic mange. Whatever, until there is DNA proof of (God forbid) this pathetic creature being a new species, my money is on the pitiful, diseased coyote.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY--Goon:
From: Rangoon posted Tue, Sep 1 2009, 9:36am 
Along those same lines the coyote population is increasing steadily,at least in my area. 30 years ago there weren't any and now seeing them during the day infrequently is not actually rare. Road kills are common.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY--Goon:
From: hroth posted Wed, Sep 2 2009, 5:22pm 
Back in the 80's we argued whether or not we could prove coyotes were here in Ohio.

Now, they're everywhere.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY--Goon:
From: AustraliaMegalania posted Wed, Sep 2 2009, 9:31pm 
Whatever, until there is DNA proof of (God forbid) this pathetic creature being a new species,

naked mole rats, chinese crested dogs ect say hi.

nearly completely hairless, susceptible to skin cancer, but far from pathetic.

Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: TonyCannon posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 8:01pm 
Bet it's right up there with this one:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzmmlaZ9b9I
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: The13Bats posted Mon, Aug 31 2009, 8:43pm 
You know what irks me is when the chubacabra went from being some bazzar bio impossibilty in a mix of Reptile, mammal, winged kangaroo, with big glowing eyes like some nocturnal bush baby with a long hollow tongue that was more of a flexible proboscises for feeding to being some poor riddled with disease and mange Coyote, Chihuahua dog because some Texas gal who was bored and needed her time in the spot light says this is a chubacabra,
DNA shows coyote markers, so at best it's a new or sub species, not the odd ball whatever the heck it was reported in Puerto Rico,
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: hardyman1014 posted Tue, Sep 1 2009, 1:49am 
i watched this show after reading this post.. adn i have to wonder.. what exactly does that poor animal have to do with chupacabra?? back in the day i remember when reports of it first started appearing.. it had big glowing red eyes, spikes on it head that ran down its back, clawed hands, a spiked tongue that it used to stab animals, mostly goats, in the back of the neck and sucked their blood out, had scales, and i cant remember but i think it might have been reported to have wings.

what wa in tha video was a poor coyote with mange and cataracts. at most id give them it is a decendant of a coyote that has some mutation that it passed along to its off spring, but that is streching it.

the part where she claimed it had bone in the sacks on it hind legs, did she have an x-ray done to verify this or is she just going on feel. it she is just going on feel it is possiable that its not bone but sores and callises built up from it dragging its hind end around trying to aliveate itself from the itching pain of the mange.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: EastTxSwamp posted Tue, Sep 1 2009, 8:35am 
I, too, mourn the days when a chupacabras was something really weird and gruesome. I think it has to do with the Anglocizing (is that a word?) of the Mexican culture. The Mexican/Texan culture along the Rio Grande is beautifully rich with legends and stories, everything from hidden treasure in the Chisos to the ghost lights of Indians. The story of the original chupacabras is still intact on the border. There's a town called Lajitas, not too far from Marfa and Alpine, that elected a beer-drinking goat as mayor a few years back; if you go down there and asked about the chupacabras, I imagine you'd get something more like the original version.


As the legend moves north from Mexico it seems to change, primarily because of local TV stations doing "Get this, folks" type news stories. The nutjob in Cuero, though, kind of reversed the trend, carrying the 'mangy dog' version of the cryptid back south again.

Swamp
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: luna1580 posted Tue, Sep 1 2009, 9:51pm 
from the linked thread below: (by me)

i think it went down like this:

the original crazy chimaera/alien/paranormal sighting reports came out of puerto rico coupled with reports of a phenomenon -livestock animals apparently drained of blood- and because the public has no general concept of the fact that correlation is not causation, the creature and the phenomenon became linked and the the creature gained the name "goatsucker" (even though the first reported "victims" were sheep).

then a similar phenomenon surfaces in texas: apparently "sucked dry" livestock. enough people in texas speak/understand spanish that someone gets told a story and exclaims "el chupacabra!" but either doesn't know/doesn't relate the description of the original animal associated with the name.

then an "anomalous animal" (or at least one people aren't used to seeing) pops up in texas, and -again failing the correlation/causation concept- the good people of texas associate this apparent phenomenon with this different reported animal. wha-la! the "naked dog" chupa is born! (this is the way of mythology/folklore).

things to remember:

*we don't have real, conclusive evidence that all these poor "sucked dry" animals, anywhere, aren't victims of known forms of predation/scavenging/decomp.

*even if the livestock phenomenon is real, we have no evidence that either the "island version" or "mainland version" "chupas" are responsible for it.

in conclusion, i have no doubt that the "naked dog" chupas are real critters. i do have doubt that they are ultimately responsible (or solely responsible) for the "vampire killings". many of the doggie chupas are poor mangey coyotes. but i think it is very likely that a naturally hairless and dark skin-pigmented domestic dog breed (see the mexican and peruvian hairless dog pics in the other chupa thread, both of which have overland and human assisted access to texas) has bred itself into a slightly different mutt form in the texas wildlands, it may also have created a new and fertile hairless dog-coyote-wolf hybrid out there and formed a breeding population of "chupas".

now, the chimera chupa? that's a different (and in my mind improbable) kettle of monsters.
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: luna1580 posted Tue, Sep 1 2009, 8:48pm 
do we really have to keep talking about chupas all the time?

the tranformation of el chupacabra

coyotes w/&w/out mange
Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: luna1580 posted Tue, Sep 1 2009, 8:49pm 
mexican hairless dogs

Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: luna1580 posted Tue, Sep 1 2009, 8:49pm 
peruvian hairless dogs

Subject: Re: CHUPACABRA AUTOPSY
From: luna1580 posted Tue, Sep 1 2009, 8:54pm 
and a another peruvian, for the road.

let's not forget that it could just as easily be a combination of mangy canines and perhaps a feral breeding population of dogs or dog-coyote hybrids who are carrying the "hairless dog" coat mutation, acquired from escaped pets or latin american hairless breeds who arrived in TX on their own....



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